Hi all,


I've been using my Alto TS112A with 11R for a year and a half, and are looking into upgrading my monitor solution. I'm not sure if I'll go with another frfr monitor, or maybe I might go for an Atomic Reactor type of setup.

I've gotten some fine sounds out of my Alto, but find that I need to EQ quite a bit to get there. At a gig I did a couple of weeks ago I spent way to much time EQ'ing at the rehearsals (even though I'd dialed in the presets at gig level volume on beforehand), so I missed out of quite a bit of the actual rehearsals (the brazz band I was rehearsing with had to play without me for most of the time, as I was to busy EQ'ing trying to get a decent sound). I'm not sure how the sound was on FOH monitors, so I can only talk about the sound I got in my Alto which I used as a personal monitor.

Anyway, what I'd like is a setup that "just works". I'd love to show up for rehearsals and quickly get a decent sound. One thought I've had is maybe go for a amp based solution such as Atomic Reactor or Tech 21, which to my knowledge would get me closer to a real amp sound than a frfr monitor such as the Alto would. I would probably loose some of the features of the 11R, but maybe it would be easier and quicker to get decent sounds at the rehearsals.

Another option would be to upgrade to a better frfr, such as Atomic CLR or something. My concern is that I'd still be stuck in EQ'ing rather than actually playing the next time I do the brazz band gig.

I'd really like it if I could still send line level signal to the mixer (from either the 11R or the monitor), but it's not a must.

I apologize for the long post, but I'll try and sum up:
1) What benefits would changing from the Alto to an amp such as Atomic Reactor give me?
2) What benefits would changing from the Alto to a better frfr speaker such as the Atomic CLR give me?
3) Will either of the above options make it faster and easier to dial in decent tones during rehearsals/sound checks?


Greetings,
Kenneth

At home I play thru a tube power amp/4x12" cab, Rig output no cab. You can easily do the same if you don't mind carrying a 4x12" cab (or any other cab), mike the cab and that's it.

Thanks, that may be an option. Alternatively, going for the Atomic Reactor (or Tech 21) type of option would probably give me somewhat of a similar setup, as I would be playing my Eleven Rack through a real(?) guitar speaker.

Any thoughts on how upgrading to a better frfr speaker might influence the sound I get out of the Eleven Rack?

I am one of the people here that play through an FRFR after coming to the 11r from a traditional amp plus cab setup. I tried the 11r through the amp to the cab, much like I used to use my 2101, as a preamp, and didn't like the discrepancy in tone from live in the room to usb in and recording. The patches I had set up for live through the amp sounded like ass through the usb or in headphones. I tried it both in to the guitar in as well as in the return of the amp's fx loop, nothing evened things out.

I then switched from an amp head to a poweramp into the cab, closer but still same problems. Then I put the 11r into an FRFR (an EV zlx12p) and set up the patches to sound good through that and found they translated very well to headphones and through usb recording. Things got even better for "real amp sound" when I added the EPSi w/ ownhammer cab IRs in the FX loop of the 11r, that's what I am working with now and it is awesome!

I find I still have to double-check patches to see how they sound at stage volume, but I find everything is much more consistent run through an FRFR. To more directly address your post I have used both an Alto TS110A as well as a Behringer B212D before discovering the EV, both of these got me closer to the great tone I feel I have now but neither were as good as the EV. These are just my experiences, YMMV.

I will say this, I really like the flexibility of the eq section on the ElectroVoice ZLX 12P, since your original post mentioned trouble setting the eq on your ts112a. Yes, I think the zlx12p sounds better than the ts110a and behringer B212d, but I think the eq flexibility really sets it apart..

Thanks for the reply.

Maybe not an easy question to answer, but in what way did using the EV improve your sound and general experience, as opposed to using the TS112A?

Furthermore, will using a high quality frfr need less eq'ing to achieve a great sound than a lower quality frfr? I mean, using the TS112A I find that many rigs sound really unnatural/digital (let's be honest: awful) before I get quite a bit of eq'ing in there. Perhaps a better frfr would make the rigs sound better to begin with, and need less eq'ing to get them so sound like a real guitar?

EDIT: In other words, in an ideal world the Eleven Rack would sound great out of the box when running through my TS112A, kind of like just plugging into different amps and cabs. But I find that this rarely works, and I need to EQ a lot to get the patches sound natural and non-digital. So what I'm hoping is that upgrading to a better frfr (or maybe an amp such as atomic CLR) would make the Eleven Rack sound more like a real amp out of the box. Of couse I would need to do some eq'ing to adapt my bedroom presets to live use, but hopefully no more than I would need to do with a real amp.

Do you have the Singtall pack?
I found just using those right out of the box with no editing made the 11r sound far more 'real'.

In addition to that I should point out I was running into a Yamaha DTX powered wedge.
The trick is the eq pre and post amp, he has really nailed it and tbh it saves a whole hell of a lot of tweaking.

I just thought the EV was more open, not so much higher pitched or anything, just clearer. I liked that sound both with mp3's played through it as well as 11r. I had the EV coming off of one rig out (Right side) and the Alto off of the other rig output (Left side), the 11r through the EV just sounded like it does when I am wearing studio headphones. I like the EV but I really want to get a decent (==pricey) 8" speaker now (like a yamaha dxr8 or EV zxa1), for enhanced portability for practice and trips.



I found that setting patches on the 11r to sound good through studio monitors or headphones translates well to the EV (better than the alto) and I find this preferable to using a tube amp power section into a cab, yeah, I can get that setup to sound good but then stuff doesn't sound right through usb tracking. I still find that no matter what I do I have to have a few go to patches set up exclusively for high volume. I have put some of my favorite tracking or low volume practice patches through venue PAs and have been very disappointed with the realization that these high volume situations made my patches sound very metal-esque, gainy, and scooped. I don't know if there is any workaround to this other than having a few live-volume patches, the majority of my time with the 11r is spent at tracking volumes. I hope that helps.

Thanks ProfessorBen and Downrazor11.

I do have the Singtall superpack, and have found some good presets there. I've also dialed in some presets of my liking myself, so I do manage to get some good sounds out of the Alto. But I'd really like an frfr that would make the Eleven Rack sound good kind of out-of-the-box, even before tweaking the EQ. I'm hoping a better frfr might get me there. Of course on will need to adjust the EQ to different environments, but if I could have a setup where an Eleven Rack, say, Fender amp&cab sounded close to a real Fender amp&cab without throwing in Para EQ in the first place, that would really be great. Don't know it that at all possible, but maybe a better frfr would get me closer.

Downrazor11, thanks for your thoughts on the EV. I really like what you wrote about it being just clearer - this sound quite interesting. I'll keep my eyes open for used EVs, and see if I can get a hold of one.

I have the EV ZLX12-P's They are far from flat. Scooped sounding. I use them for vocal monitors or sometimes FOH. My FRFR is a JBL prx612m. Sounds like your problem is the room(s) more than the FRFR. Esp if you get a good sound at gig volume before the rehearsal. Rooms esp smaller ones with low ceilings and hard surfaces have all sorts of problems. There is software to figure this out. My old rehearsal space had a natural bump at 300-500hz and all sorts of reflections. I always wondered why my Marshall sounded fine at rehearsal and thin at some venues. One set patch will not sound the same in different rooms no matter what FRFR you have. So I'd just build a few patches for live with the horn band where they play and be done with it. Or go IEM and that's a whole nother can of worms...