Hey everyone,

First time poster here. Just got an Eleven Rack last month to use for a wedding band I gig with regularly.

http://www.gigmasters.com/Cover-Band/amfmla

We run in ear monitors and everyone is running through the PA direct other than the drummer of course for stage volume issues.

Anyone using the Eleven Rack direct for gigs? I basically run the 11r as an clean/semi clean amp modeler and run my drive, delays, etc... through the front of the 11r.

Here are my settings:
Les Paul, Amp MS-30 Vol 6.3, Bass 5.5, Treble 5.1, Cut 2.2, Mast 9.8, Gate off, Output 5.2, Cab 2x12 AC blue.

My issue is that it seems the 11r has some kind of limiter built in to it? It seems as though I'm not getting the headroom I'd like. When I switch on my drive pedals, especially the heavier ones(wampler pinnacle) it seems that the 11r squashes/limits the peak signal (sorry, not sure exactly how else to describe it). Not sure if anyone else has experienced this. The main output meter on the 11r isn't peaking, even when I switch on my drives so I assume I'm not running the outputs too hot.

Am I setting up the 11r incorrectly? Is this a normal occurrence that happens with digital amp modelers? Any help would be much appreciated

Hi, I always use the 11R connected to PA console directly.
I use mostly internal effects but when I have to add some, I use the FX loop. It is mostly a Eventide H9 for the chorus. So my guitar is also directly connected to the 11R.
I have pretty good tones with that.

Bzek.

Have you tried pulling down either the "Vol" or "Mast" parameters? I guess I would assume with settings that high, you might even start running out of the amp model headroom with high output pickups and hear some squish and/or distortion with heavy playing. Kick on an external pedal and it would get worse. I'd try dropping those numbers slightly and increase the "Output" parameter to compensate for volume if you need to.
Or, try your pedals into one of the other clean amp models and see if you notice the same thing.... maybe one of the digidesign models like modern clean.
I can make the MS-30 model, the bogner clean model, and the soldano clean models all breakup (no external pedals) with settings in that range.
What were you using before the 11R?

Thanks Bzer, my modulation pedals aren't really the issue. It's the drives that seem to squash when I kick them on. I appreciate the input!

Thanks noguud. I like a small amount of breakup in my clean and that setting seems to get it for me but just gets really squashed when I kick drive pedals on. I noticed that the output of the 11r seems to be capped or limited when I'm looking at my mix on stage. We use a mackie dl1608 and control our own separate in ear mix on iPads. The meters on the iPad seem to look the same when I'm playing my clean sound or when the drive pedal is kicked in. Is that because the headroom of the amp model is maxed out?

I used to use low wattage amps with an attenuator...super champ, ac15, matchless lightning.

the amp models in the eleven rack operate like real world amps. if you run a real world amp that loud, you will run out of headroom and get compression. settings that high would probably make you deaf too.

i would make one of two adjustments:

1) run the amp at a lower setting like you would in the real world.

or

2) set the output of the drive pedals low so as to not push the amp much further than you need to. start at almost off and work your way up until you get as much gain as you want without compressing the amp model.

the cool thing about the eleven rack is that it CAN emulate a wide open amp with output tube distortion. that can be good or bad depending on if you like power tube distortion. many artists crank an amp in the studio just to get the tone you are trying to dial out.

So I tried your settings listed above, and left the Rig Output set to 0 (don't know where you have it set). I also used the Cond 87 off-axis mic model, not sure what you are using there.

That is a LOUD patch and all output meters are pegged for me, headphones, main outs, digital outs (which I use in my setup at home), outputs to amp, etc.

I think you need to back down on the amp "Output". Try going from 5.2 to maybe -1.5 or lower.

I think a good rule of thumb is to keep your patches to have the same apparent volume as the factory set. Then use the meters if you run into issues like this. You can set your "output to amp" tap point to different points along the virtual rig, and also use that to troubleshoot.

In your case, I think your amp is just loud, and I'd keep this lower especially is you are using some of the FX blocks, delay or reverb in the 11R after the amp model. The 11R may have some limiting built in because it doesn't sound as nasty as I thought it would, but it sounds better to me when I back down on the amp output. If you don't use any post amp FX, delay or reverb, you can back down on the rig output and achieve the same thing. I use Rig Output as a last volume tweak to balance rigs relative to eachother, just small nudges here for me mostly.

And your patch sounds very broken up for me, but I don't have a les paul to try so maybe its cleaner for you. I'd definitely try dropping the master volume and/or gain a bit if you want more headroom on the amp model after cleaning up your rig volume.

One last thing that can cause issues that you may need to troubleshoot - which output do you use? XLRs, output to amps, FX sends? Make sure you match the output to the input of your mixer (instrument vs line level). That is another possible issue that can cause some limiting and loudness issues.

Good luck and I hope you get it figured out.

My hunch is besides what the others are saying is that is a digital mixer (kind of like what I use [line 6 M20D]) and there is built in limiting in it and that may be the problem... You haven't said whether or not you have tried it through an amp or monitors or something else.

Thanks for the help! I tried turning down the output and it helped tremendously. I need to do a little more tweaking but I think I'm on the right track! I appreciate everyone's input!

I use an 11R for maybe 50% of my gigs into a countryman DI and out to house.. like Singtall mentioned.. I'd go in and adjust the amp master or rig volume and pull that down to give you the headroom that you're seeking.. you can still get the clean breakup.. you could even really tweak that between adjusting the rig output or amp master AND pulling a bit of breakup back in by tweaking the speaker breakup slider.. I haven't encountered this and I will run a Suhr Riot or Exotic BB Plus in front from time to time depending on what I need for the gig/session/set or shoot.