Had the ultra and now have the axe2-though I will be selling it and going back to the elevenrack. It used to be that I needed the axe for all the extra stuff-violin tones and wierdness, thought I was never really happy with those tones. Long story short-I grabbed a GR55 which kills on all the wierd stuff. Sax, keys, cello, violin, harmonica-and no single note limitation on the synth stuff. B3, geez the list goes on. Well over half our set I play something besides a guitar tone-on at least 3 songs I dont play any guitar. Sax, piano and flute on moondance for instance.

So the axe2 became amps only-I dont use much beyond a wah on a few songs, and a rotary on one or two. Maybe a well effected(chorus delay etc) clean tone here and there. So I press 5 buttons total on the MFC-all freaking night, 3 presets, boost, rotary(seether lead). Kind of a waste or a rockstar unit.

A lot of money sitting there-so I looked into the Blackstar ID series-but I wasn’t sold. Then I noticed that the 11R without protools was everywhere for under 4 bills. Crazy. I've paid more than that for overdrives. Then the lack of need to deal with protools at all-perfect. Two days after arrival, I have my all-access programed, 4 banks of tones ready to roll-and band practice tonight. I had one before, so the learning curve was shorter-though I did pick up some new info-like the FXloop as a boost thing. I gigged the 11R for a while year before last. Got a ton of complements, but I thought I was missing something - and got the Axe2 that November. I was also sick of fighting with protocols and being locked to the home computer to mess with patches.

Axe2 is the bomb. No doubt about it. What's the saying-once the drummer kicks in...but do I need it with the 50-60 tunes we gig? Nope. Heck, I’ve done it with a mini-rec and the GR55. And being able to buy 2 11Rs for the price of the MFC101…

Side by side-through the same power amp and speakers…I like my two day old presets better. Probably some honeymoon going on there. Don’t get me wrong, I have a great Jubilee patch on the Axe but I wouldn’t say the 11R patches suffer in comparison.

And the most important part-it looks cooler on top of my 2x12 orange cab! I seriously get a ton of complements on that stupid little cab, more than all other gear combined. And the all-access and gr55 are both blue, so my foot controller situation almost looks like I planned it. It’s also shorter than the axe and fits in my short rack case-which is a perfect match to that amazing little orange cab.

Had...a lot of modelers. HD500, Kemper(2), 11R, GSP1101, assorted other line6 stuff, tonelab, all the way back to a little zoom box that you stuck on your strap…going back to my Seattle days. Pretty sure if you work at it you can get a workable tone out of any other them. I’ll be working the eleven rack at this point.

Thanks to sangtall and benoni and the rest of the patch masters out there. Really too many to choose from. Reminds me of the tons of Kemper rigs I had-but at least you can just try these patches without a bunch of stick swapping and reboots. Sorry for the rambling.
Rock on!

WELCOME BACK TO DA RACK!

Dang that is crazy

Mirrors my experiences as well... went through a ton of high end gear, including Axe products, eventually sold everything and landed back on the Eleven Rack.

Why?

Simple... for the money it provides the best tone bed, the best interface and the best variety.

The Axe FX is more capable, sure it is, but it's not better by any means.

The Kempler is another awesome product, but again, for the difference in price just doesn't make sense.

My assumption is the internet is what has killed the Eleven Rack. The product itself is phenomenal, but everyone bagged on them from the start.

It amazes me how opposed so many people are to this product having never even played one. They just look at the price and conclude it must be one fifth the quality of the Axe FX.

Well, worked out for us as we were able to get one for cheap cheap cheap!

Says the guy who told me the axe fx 2 wasn't all it was cracked up to be having never played one . Not trying to be a dick just proving your point;)

Haha... I never said above I played an Axe FX 2, I mirrored my experiences stating what is true, that I've owned both, and played through both an Axe FX Standard and an Axe FX Ultra.

While the Axe FX II provides a slightly different interface and a second CPU for amp simulations, the bulk of tones produced are the same between the two products.

As I've also said before, the Axe FX is an outstanding product with amazing tone and functionality. But, at the end of the day, so does the Eleven Rack, and for the difference in cost, I kept the 11.

Your mileage will most certainly vary.

But how do you know that about the axe2 if you have never played one? And when I said I was getting the Axe 2 this is what you said, "Enjoy it dude! But from my own personal experience it's not all it's cracked up to be." Tons of firmware updates since the axe 2 between the ultra and they still sound the same? Cliff stated that the Ultra and Standards could not run G2 modeling because of their limited horsepower, so they obviously are not the same core tones....

Wait, I'm confused... I've said several times I've never owned an Axe FX II.

Also, I've said multiple times the tone was amazing and feature set comprehensive.

The differences between an Axe FX Ultra and the Axe FX II are not absolute, there are differences, yes, but it's not a system wide overhaul. It will produce for you, more tonal option, more connectivity and interface methods as well as variations on amp/cab simulation.

Dialing up a specific tone on either will provide like results.

My points have been made several times, I have owned Axe FX products, as well as Line 6, Boss and Vox products... I settled on the Eleven Rack due to lack of complexity, quality of specific tones, and finally price.

I've also said, you might enjoy the Axe FX products... and have never suggested you were making a mistake in buying one, I simply said if you could keep your Eleven Rack until after having time to play with the Axe FX you might come to a similar conclusion as I have.

That's all.

I am speaking from my own personal experiences. There's no need to suggest the Axe FX II is so revolutionary in it's capability that having only owned an Axe FX Standard and FX Ultra removes me from being competent in drawing experienced comparisons.

I can help here..

The 11R is fantastic! But it cannot keep up the Axe 2. As far as the Standard and Ultra goes, I spent half a day with a guy that has gigged with an Ultra since it came out, an absolute genius with it, and it does not hold a fart in a bag compared to the Axe 2..NO ONE that has SPENT TIME with BOTH will ever tell you anything different. I would love to figure out how to get a Kemper too, but I do not see that happening..I would however love to have another 11R, as I am most familiar with it and it has some GREAT tones!

I am confused too. You say you never owned the Axe 2 but you keep making comparisons like you have played one. I am puzzled. If I have never owned something I would never make comparisons. I am not saying the axe2 is so revolutionary from the Ultra/Standard I am just saying how would you know for sure if you never used one. Just seems like common sense to me.
See now Birdie here is talking common sense.

A rather bold statement, and one that is not shared by many who have claimed to own both products.

But, if to your ears the difference between the Axe FX Ultra and the Axe FX II is so extreme as to claim the previous nothing more than a bag of fart, well, then it's a darn good thing you've made that purchase.

Let me lay this out as simple as possible:

1. I have owned both an Axe FX Standard and Ultra.

2. I have owned Boss, Line 6 and Vox multi effects products.

3. I have sold them all and have kept the Eleven Rack.

4. I kept my Eleven Rack because to my ears, the tones and effects I needed were readily available and equal in quality to that of the other products.

5. The Axe FX is an amazing product, endless possibilities and oustanding tone.

6. The Axe FX slowed down my progression as a player because of it's endless complexity.

7. It's a good idea that you're buying an Axe FX II.

8. I only wish you could keep the Eleven Rack long to compare the two side by side.

9. The technology inside the Axe FX II is not so revolutionary as to render the Axe FX a pile of shite as suggested by birdie.

10. We all do hear what we must to justify the money we have spent.

11. Arguing on the internet is like competing in the special olympics, and as such I will say no more about any of the above products.

Telling us we all hear what we want to hear to justify a purchase? From the start it has seemed like you are trying to jam down my throat that I was unwise in spending my money on the axe 2 because it is not that much better than the eleven rack. What is great for me may not be great for you and those who haven't used a product should not comment on it. Instead of saying it is not that much better you should have said something like FOR ME NEEDS it is not that much better....still then you never used it so you really should have said nothing to be honest.

And I am not sure what you are talking about but I have read many a threads where people say the axe2 is in a whole different league than the ultra/standard.

I repeat:

7. It's a good idea that you're buying an Axe FX II.

8. I only wish you could keep the Eleven Rack long to compare the two side by side.

And I have read just as many that claim it is not.

Ok thats fantastic

Ok, I promised I pledged to make at least one smart ass comment every quarter or so here goes:

Shouldn't this thread be on the AXE forum? I hear they love this this kind of stuff over there!!!

JOKING GUYS LIGHTEN UP!!!!

I don't think the ultra is a piece of shit at all..I was looking for a way to get one when the Axe 2 deal literally fell into my lap..

I am merely saying that the Ultra is an entire generation (and more, now, especially with FW10 comping out) ahead of the Ultra, and that it is not a fair comparison between the 2. The Ultra is still in 2nd place as far as I am concerned, but if I can get a Kemper, that might change!

"...does not hold a fart in a bag compared to the Axe 2..."

As I said, pretty bold statement, especially if you suggest the Ultra is second only to the FX II.

And on top of that, the Ultra doesn't bring anything different to the table tonally than the Standard, all it really provides is the memory required to process a larger effects chain.

As for the Kempler, this is part of the problem with internet forums in general, people toss the Kempler in the same genre as the Ultra FX. They're not really the same type of device.

The true idea beyond the Kempler is to provide a touring musician, or a studio with a specific bands tonal needs in one small package. That is to say, if your band uses three amps, for clean, dirty, heavy, etc. instead of having to drag all three around, the Kempler allows you to record your exact tone and emulate it when needed.

The Axe FX is a straight up simulator. It's a tone creator. It's design is to provide you with various tone stacks and large amounts of effect pedal variety.

One is designed to be your entire rig, the other, a compliment.

this thread degenerated into a piss fight...which is dumb. everybody has an opinion. if you are sensitive because you just bought an axe-fx 2 then maybe this isn't the best thread for you to read. i don't own anything better than the eleven rack and i haven't heard any version of the axe-fx in person. but having said all of that; if Birdie (who i trust) says the axe-fx 2 sounds better...than i believe him. that's the joy of this forum...many brothers that you can trust to steer you into the right direction.

if you still feel the need to vent about the axe-fx, please do it at another forum.

Sorry man but I am not sensitive about the situation. My thing is he was making comparisons about a product he never used. And on top of that he said he hates when people say negative things about the eleven rack who never used it when when in reality he was doing the EXACT same thing. One thing I keep saying is whatever sounds best to YOU is what is best for YOU. I hate when people say such and such sounds better because while it may sound better to you it may not sound better to me for MY needs.
And to Celtic I understand where you are coming from. I can see why you may not be favorable towards Cliff due to some comments in the past. I also understand what you are saying when it won't make you a better player. Unlike FizRack you are being completely rational and using common sense so I see your point.
And too FizRack let me end this now, and put it in numbers like you did.
1.The Eleven Rack fits YOUR needs perfectly
2.The AxeFX II fits MY needs perfectly
3.End of story

Oh I don't doubt that Birdie experiences better audio reproduction from his Axe FX II than from his Eleven Rack, in fact, I've never argued the Axe provides nothing but outstanding tonal reproduction.

My surprise is his assessment that the Axe FX II places the Axe FX Ultra into a position of not even being able to hold a bag of fart when directly compared.

Not really fair IMO to compare the 11r with a AxeFX unit.
The 11r has some good amp models and your basic effects...The AxeII has all that and more with all kinds of bells and whistles.
If you think it sounds $1,500 better, then you should buy one. Whether or not the amp models actually sounds better is an opinion(not a fact). Its important that we seperate opinions from facts here. If you believe one sounds better than the other then you are right(if you believe it then who cares what anyone else thinks). I can remember back in the day when I saved up for 2 months to buy the Digitech GSP21 when it first came out..me and all my musician friends thought it was the best guitar tone ever! Its only a matter of time before something bigger and badder comes out, and then you don't have what you consider the "best" anymore

You know what, people like you make it impossible to express an opinion on the internet anymore. YOU came into this thread looking for a fight.

I NEVER ONCE said I EVER compared the Axe FX II to the Eleven Rack. I specifically stated TIME AND TIME again that I had ONLY used an Axe FX Standard and Axe FX Ultra, as I had owned both units.

How many Axe FX Products have you used?

My guess would be none.

You just can't stand the idea that somebody might have an opinion that even in the slightest takes away from your decision to invest three grand into a single piece of equipment.

I NEVER even once said you shouldn't buy one, EVER. I said it's too bad you couldn't keep the Eleven Rack long enough to perform a direct head to head with the two units.

The irony with your inability to accept my personal opinion based on direct use across the field with the Axe FX and the Eleven Rack, attempting to claim my feelings and decisions are invalid when who knows what range of products you have personally ever even used yourself is laughable.

Accept others while you chase your dreams, there's no need to reject if you're confident in your own decision.

Well said. Couldn't agree with you more.

to get this back to eleven rack related stuff...


i actually decided on the eleven rack after hearing waliman's videos. i thought the eleven rack sounded better for MY taste. if i thought the axe-fx 2 sounded better by far, i would have bought it by now. i believe the axe-fx is capable of much more than Waliman dialed up for sure. but in his comparison, the differences were not worth $1500 more money to me.

THE WAY HE SET THEM UP: i thought the axe-fx 2 sounded WAY better than the previous models of axe-fx.....but still not a bunch better than the eleven rack.

Wow, this thread took a turn. My intent was just to share that having been around the block with all the major modellers-I chose the 11R. That was it. Since I have owned a bunch-and gigged most-here are my thoughts on each.

Pod X,Y,Z-I had the floor pod, HD147 and even an HD500. Try as I might-and I tried mightily, just couldnt get anything I liked out of them. I would think I did, then get to practice and turn up-and spend practice adjusting and never getting there.

GSP1101-great unit, though very dated now-still a great finisher product. Stick this in 4cm with any head and you have a complete solution. Gigged a few times like that with a blackstar combo.

AXE Ultra-hours of frustration. Relied heavily on others presets and still never quite got where I wanted to be. Gigged a few times, finally got tired of it and sold it.

11R(round 1)-loved the look, loved the tones. Hated dealing with protools. Hard time installing protools(cd errors), hard time with support. Hard time selling it because of license issues. Gigged a few times, loved the tones, but felt stuck.

Kemper-Super easy to use. Needs a foot controller(out yet?) Compared to fractal, takes forever for things to come out. Only way to load rigs was usb stick and reboot, though I think they fixed that reboot as I was bailing on it. Gigged once. Upside-a ton of rigs, downside-many werent good and organization is a nightmare.

Axe2-much improved version. Easy to get good tones. I blew mine up. Happens when you reach around and stick the RJ45 connector into the USB port, or was it the other way around. Anyway, had to send it back. They turned it around quick and for a fair price. I don't know what you CAN't do with this thing. Used it for synth stuff as well as guitar tones. Mainly just a few guitar tones. Synth was a little lame because you can only hit 1 note at a time. Farts out otherwise. Going to sell mine.

GR-55-This took all the weird needs out of the Axe. It does all of it better-way better. Multi notes, multi-instruments. Piano on one string, cello on the next, whatever. Acoustic tones kick butt. Unchained me from the Axe.

11R-round 2. Had it two days, brought it to practice(last night), loved it. Pretty much stayed with a bogner, ac30 and JTM patch and had no issues. Threw the fxloop last and used that for a boost, but waiting on a cable and then I'll use the mixed thing, seems easy enough and reminds me of the GSP1101 cntrl button setup, only variable. I need to make a new stage snake(just wrap the cables I need, midi, 2 1/4TS, 1 1/4TRS) to make life easier at gigs. The guys at practice were actually commenting on good the rig sounded-they didnt notice it was different, I didnt point it out until we came to a seether tune I usually downtune -1 using an axe preset. I can do that with the GR55 but I didnt have time to build a pre for that. I prefer the GR55 version anyway, but it's amp tones just arent in the same ballpark. Okay for one song. Two really, I use the guitar tones heavily in Lonely Boy(need the whammy).

Hopefully that is enough rambling to get back on subject, though I'll say it again, they all rock and lots of blokes get great tones from all of them. They all beat the G100-212 I had in high school!

I agree we should get back to the subject. We are not going to get anywhere arguing. If I offended anyone I apologize.

As do I... I am sorry.

On an interesting side note, we both have the exact same registration date. What are the odds?

That's crazy, I never noticed that until now.

NICCCEE!!! Now that's more like it guys!!

Different eyes see different things
Different hearts beat on different strings
But there are times
For you and me, when all such things agree

Got the Axe FX2 a couple hours ago and this thing is amazing, it is so much better than I could have hoped for

I knew you would like it.

Hello Guys,
I'm new with 11rack. One question. I want to output my Roland GR55 and use it truth Elevenrack to go to my Protools. Should I use the guitar input jack of eleven rack from my guitar output of the Roland GR-55?
Thank's
JG

The Kemper is really a different type of product. I has effects, etc., but it's mainly an amp profiler. The price may seem high, at first, but when you consider it has all other amps in it, it's possibly the cheapest amp head you'll ever buy. It's also, pretty much, future proof. Any new amp comes out, there will be a profile for it in a couple of days.

I've used many modelers for many years. I bought the Kemper, and quickly realized that modelers give you a bit of leeway, by covering your mistakes, etc. The Kemper acts like a real amp. That's why when some people move to a real amp, they sound horrible. It took me a couple of days to break any bad habits I had that modelers would cover.

I know its an old post and i,m not a regular around here but to the O.P...no need to apologise as you certainly were not rambling.Very informative post.
The fact that your thread created a stir is proof positive to me that the 11R punches above its weight.
To me there is just enough choice in the 11R ….not too much as to cause "option paralysis"

had a kemper, sold it. had and played live with an axe fx 2 and was asked to go to playing through an amp, sold it. haven't missed either and now never go on fractal site to look for updates etc. nothing i have ever tried beats the evh brown sound preset on the 11r. period. now i play through a moded ac10c1 and love that sound. for messing around, in seem to never change the knob of the brown sound preset. its just heaven sent to me.

I respectfully disagree. If you had the Kemper, why didn't you just profile the brown sound? You can tweak it to be better than the original, clarity, pick attack, etc.

i liked the axe fx 2 better than the kemper, hands down. i could tone match the just the same on the axe. too lazy i guess. just my experience.